I'm sure many of you have read my thread on 'Youth Intolerence' (that was a fun one) and this will kind of tie in with it.



There lies a town 15 minutes away from the town with the Church that kicked me out of. This other town has a different Baptist Church, and the pastor (and personal friend, and spiritual teacher) has asked me to come and guest speak at his Youth Group on pacifism, conquering anger with peace, and faith and practice.



Now many people from the Church that kicked me outh informed the Pastor that I was a Buddhist... of course he knew that. And they do not think it would be an abomination to have a Buddhist teaching Christians (I guess Christians are genetically superior) faith and practice.



Here's my question: Would you be insulted or offended if a Buddhist was teaching you about faith, spirituality, and practice? Why or why not?

now, ggd. I am glad that you others will still allow you to come to their church, to me (even though it is not for you) this means that there is a chance that you will be saved. But, for you, it is also a good thing because then you can continue to spread peace!



So, we both get pluses, right?



Anyway, here is what I have to say, without getting all Holy Rollerish on you (though i am still praying for your soul. Becuase of the last incident between that other church and yourself, I would advise you not to speak too much about your religion. I am sorry, but their are several reasons why.



1. The same situation could happen again, and that will cause differnt people to be angry and stressed.



2. If there are some Holy Rollers in that church that absolutely love the church, and those people find out that the church allowed a Budhist to come in and 'preach' to them, they may want to leave because they ,may not like Budhism (no offense). Then, they are stressed, the church loses members, and friendships are broken. I know, it sounds bad, but I am just saying what could happen.



3. You may lead some people away from their faith or make them believe something about their faith that is not right. Other will see what you have done, and will not like this, and then, once again, peace will be gone. Parents will pull their kids out of the church and others will leave, again. Sorry, but things aren't looking good.



Now, on the other hand (those may not be good reasons, but they are important to consider) if you do not tell them that you are Budhist, there are good and bad things.



Good- You are not allowing things to get out of hand and not so much anger and stress will be put out their.



Bad- If they find out, they will be even angrier. And, =if they are true Christians (no offense to anyone) they will make you (possibly) uncomfortable by trying to save you.



Now, if you do tell them, there is a chance that they won't care and will let you continue to preach.



Personally, I think that I would hate to have you preach to people who are not 'true Christians' yet. (no offencse, again). Although, I would love for you to tell me what you are going to say. Becuase I know that I will not waiver and be converted (you already said you didn't care) than this will just be a way for me to defend myself or help others if they are Budhist. Understand?



Plus, I think of Budhism as Satanic (no offense to you, again), so, I can teach others how to avoid its teachings if they Believe the same thing as me. I hope that you understand what I am saying to you, please don't take offense, and I don't mean this in a rude way at all.



So, what I am saying is this... read what I have said, make your own decision, and I will still be praying for your soul!



I will add more later, but I am having some family issues right now, sorry.



Bye!

They already know I'm a Buddhist. But I'm not talking to them about Buddhism, unless they ask, I'm talking to them about pacifism and turning anger in joy and what not.



But I do have a question: Do you know any Buddhist teachings? In our last speil you seemed sort of ignorant on the subject. So if you don't know the teachings (compassion, pacifism, love for all beings, moderation, peacful attitude, acceptence, understanding etc. etc.) how can you get people to not follow them? Or better yet, why don't you want people to follow some Buddhist teachings?

The pastor DEFINETLY knows I'm a Buddhist. He is also my World Religions professor. And he is aslo a very close friend of mine, and he helped me go to Buddhism. And considering from the 15 calls I got from angry parents, I'd say they know I'm a Buddhist.



And salami isn't Christianity. That doesn't mean salami is bad. I fail to see your point. It's always good to learn about other philosophies and religions, maybe they will help you with your own faith.



I get true joy from peace.



I reject Christ because I think the belief in anything supernatural is idiotic (no offense, just answering your question). And, like the Buddha thought, I think that it is irrelevent if there is a God. I find it unimportant, cultivating peace is what I think is important.



But my speach has NOTHING to do with Buddhism... at all.



But I'm glad you care about me, that pleases me. I too care about you.

A couple of thoughts:



1.) I guess if wouldn't be offended if your talk was about peace. We can all use more peace in our lives. BUT, and this is a really big but... I would want to know up front what you would be talking about becuase if it conflicted with my beliefs as a Christian, I would want the option of attending or not.



2.) I go to a Pentacostal church and one of our Pastor's-at-large is a Messianic Jew! Which, for the record, completetly blows my mind! So, yes, I do think we can learn "some" things from each other, but I have to agree with Jarla that your core beleifs are so vastly different from ours that we can't really learn much from you other than "think happy thoughts". Our peace and desire to spread peace comes from our trust and belief in God, from whom all things come. Jarla's point about that IS completely relevent becuase it is what differentiates us, and makes Christ so special. No other religious figure in history can compare and our "founder" came back from the dead, lived what He preached and taught whole new concepts that other religions cannot come close too. So, yes, it is relevent.

While you love peace, we do too, but we are also concerned for your immortal soul. For we ARE immortal, and we will spend eternity somewhere. The question is, where do YOU want to spend eternity? I hope and pray that it is with those who love and devote their lives to Christ.



Be blessed,

With love in Christ,

Ellen

I wouldn't like to spend eternity anywhere. Eternity anwhere would get really boring. So if I go anywhere I hope to be brain-dead so I don't feel time.

But can we all please keep our comments relevent to the thread? This isn't about my soul, this is not about answering prayers, this IS about whether or not someone of a different religion should be allowed to teach Christians about stuff? Whether or not I go to Hell is irrelelvent to this thread.

Well said, Jarla. It's all related, what you learn, what you teach, your soul, all of it.



Since you did get angry calls from parents, I think that'a a fairly good gauge of the kind of reception you'd get. If you don't respect that, then you are simply intent on doing what pleases YOU.



It interests me that your screen name has 316 in it, as it reflects one of my favorite Scriptures, John 3:16, which paraphrased loosely is that God loved every single person in this world enough to send His one and only Son to die for each and every person so they could be saved. I highly recommend this passage right through John 3:21.



You have a choice, as do we all. So, any discussion about your eternal soul IS relevant, becuase even if you, in your human imaginings, think that eternity would be boring, you really DON'T want to be in hell for an eternity.



God loves YOU enough that He doesn't want to see you perish. We followers of Christ, love you too. We don't want to see such an obviously intelligent and sensitive young man perish either.



Be blessed,

With love in Christ,

Ellen

For the love of Pete! This is not about me going to Hell... tell you what, let's start a new thread about me going to Hell. I would like to know your opinions on the teaching situation.



For the record, it's a Methodist church in either El Paso or Bloomington.



And I have decided I'm going to go ahead and talk to them. I am not preaching to them, I am talking. My goal in life is to help people gain tolerence of other religions, if I back down then that would be going against what I believe.



I will not speak about Buddhism, I will speak on the dangers of fanaticism and fundamentalism... and I will encourage them to share the Gospel politely with whomever they want, as long as they are not pushy and respectful.



I do not see how this will lead them away from God. The pastor really wants me to speak, so I will happily speak on his request.

I find it interesting that you ask Christian's for their opinions, then disregard them when they don't give you the confirmation that you want. You better make sure that pastor puts something in the bulletin before you speak to give parents the opporunity to find something else for their children to do that Sunday, or whenever. I have a real problem with people being in a situation that goes against their own teachings. If this is a voluntary program like on a Wednesday night that parents can bring their children to, then it's totally up to them, but I would be ticked as a parent to find that you were a speaker during a Sunday morning bible-school class when I expected my child to be taught from the Christian bible.



Be blessed,

With love in Christ,

Ellen

Hi Jarla,



From what I gather in this thread, is that the pastor knows, but obviously doesn't care about or seems clueless about the confusion and anger that the parents are already displaying. If I were attending that church, I'd be highly upset if this were thrust upon my child, without my knowledge or consent.



Not good. Not good at all.



Be blessed,

With love in Christ,

Ellen

Wow jarla... 1) I think confussion is good. Confussion makes questions, questions bring answers. From what I have seen the best Christians were once confused about Christianity.



2) Being tolerent of mass murderers? Bin Laden? Much of that comes from intolerence of other religions. The Nazis were intolerent of the Jews. Christians o Musilms (visa versa). The list goes on and on. Religious tolerence will help peace... not to be rude, but that was a horrible argument.



3) Can you prove Buddhism is wrong?



4) Looks like you owe me fifty cents. The senior pastor is who turned me on to Buddhism!



5) I think I like doing my best to help people. And, since my best friend (the pastor) knows me a LOT better then you do. I will trust his judgment, rather then yours.



6) I don't know where the Church is! Forgive me, I have never been there and have no details on it. This has nothing to do with the Buddha.... wow! I will make sure and find out where it is.



7) I told the parents there kids did not HAVE to come. They hold regular youth group Sunday evenings in the Church. This probably going to be next Friday at either the Pastor's house or somebodys farm. It is optional to come.



8) I don't expect you to say it's okay. But I want to know why. Instead of a lot of anger. If someone would tell me WHY it's wrong, and WHY it's hurting them, or WHY it's offensive maybe I'd listen better. I don't repond well to anger.



9) I'm glad you care about me. But your eyes are too so blind. We both have a lot to learn. And at least I know I still have a lot to learn.

Oh, and this is not a Youth Pastor. I've never heard of a Senior Pastor, it's a small church. But he is the only pastor there.

This is in response to one of jarla's earlier posts about how I could teach people about God: Well, if you were to actually spend 10 minutes in persona with me you would learn that I can teach people about God. If you were to speak with my Christian friends they would probably say that I helped them strengthen their faith. If you were to talk to my Muslim friend, he would tell you that I converted him Christianity. If you were to talk to me old pastor he would tell you that I have a gift of communication. If you were to talk to the pastor who wants me to give a talk he would say (this is from an email he sent me) "...these children have no religion. It seems they say they are Christian, but come Monday morning it's back to boyfriends and heroin. (sidenote: Fairbury is bad with heroin) After the incident last Friday (sidenote: there was a great big fight over a baseball game) I have come to realize that the approach I tried has failed. I would appreciate it if you were to rethink, and please come talk to these children."



My town is desperate. I am actually crying right now (I cry a lot) just thinking of the state my friends and hometown are in. In hopes that maybe my words will help some children out of the current path they are leading I will speak to them. And maybe, just maybe, give them hope of a brighter future.... or I can leave them alone... but that hasnt done any good yet.



Yes, I will just leave these children alone. That's what any decent person would do! I won't even put worth the effort to help my fellow man! yeah... violence, sex, and drug abuse is a lot better than a Buddhist trying to help! What was I thinking? (horribly sarcastic)

I wrote that last post 20 or so minutes ago. I meditated on my dilema. And, we can keep arguing if you want (I do!), but I am going to talk. If you know anything about my town, you would know that it is rampant with drugs and boredom. I lost a good friend to heroin. And have had countless other close calls. I have nothing to lose by talking to them. It's not like the parents can possibly hate me anymore than they already do... (I sealed the deal a few years back). Maybe by me talking, it will encourage them to change their lifestlyles... or maybe not. What can I lose.



I want to thank all of you for participating in this discussion. If it weren't for all of you I never would have realized how important this actually is. From the depths of my heart, thank you.

Jarla- I have agreed with you from the beginning, and I was going to add something to your post, but you already did it!



What I was going to say was DO NOT FORGET GGD, i mean, you should ignore him, but you must pray for his soul. I am sure that you don't want him or anyone else to go to hell. So, we must still pray for him even if we will not talk to him.



Adam- i would do exactly what jarl;a just said, hae your mom help you out!

Hehe, these posts livened up a horrible day for me! Jarla, your suspision is wrong. Once more, if you knew me you would know I hate chaos. Yes I do like to argue, I like to discuss, honestly arguing and discussion is all that I enjoy to do! But tell me sweet Jarla (I really like that name) when I hae mocked Christians. If I have please point it out so I can apoligize.



You are correct. I probably will make another post sometime... it puts some needed 'spice' in a mediocre existence.



Ignore me if you please to, I'm not forcing anyone to post. I've never mocked anyone, nor tried to change anyone's beliefs... I don't care if you try and change mine... that's why I'm here, maybe someone will change me, not that I really want to, but I am not bound to any doctrine or ideology.



First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then.....you win. -Mahtma Ghandi

Just an update: I cancelled the whole thing. And I let everyone know that I will be holding my own little gathering. And that was tonight (just a few hours ago). It turned out that many of the kids from the Youth Group came... it was a pretty good turn-out. There ended up being 18 people. 1 Buddhist, 2 Muslims, 5 Atheists, and 10 Christians. And it was a truly beautiful gathering. This was TRUE brotherhood. We were all loving (not sexually) our neighbors. I talked about Buddhism, Atheism, Christianity, and Islam (Islam to the best of my abilities).



It was possibly the most worth-while thing I have ever done. There was such a sense of 'oneness' in such diversity... I hope one day all of you can experience brotherhood with everybody.

I dont just single out Christians for a brotherhood. As John Lennon said, "A brotherhood of man. Imagine all the people, sharing all the wooooooorld. You may say Im a dreamer, but I'm not the only one. I hope someday you'll join us, and the world can live as one."

No joining me would not be converting Buddhism (no offense, but I really don't want anyone converting).



What is joining me in the sense that I think we should put aside our differences, keep religion on the inside, and live in peace. Regardless of our religions, or lack of religion. Nobody %100 knows if there is a God (if you are %100 sure, then the burden of proof is on you!), so I find it unnecessary to be intolerent of other beleifs. As John Lennon's spirit supposedly said, "Peace... the message is peace."

Your right, it is a faith issue. Nobody knows if their is a God or not. If everyone knew there was a God, there would be nothing to put faith in.



But you can live for God, but still keep it personal. For example, help at a food drive personally without a youth group. You can help people and not say a word about God, that's what I do. And tying this in with the first paragraph, if nobody really knows if there is a God, then why evangelize about it?



The Eskimo asks, "If I never heard of Jesus, would I go to Hell?" Then Priest replies, "No." And the Eskimo asks, "The why did you tell me?" (sorta off topic, but I like it)



I'm not going to respond to the talking with God thing, not that I don't respect it, more just because I can not say your not talking to God, so have fun.



I liked that you said 'supposedly'. Your stats just went up in my book.

"But you can live for God, but still keep it personal."



Sorry, but no you can't. Ggd, I know that i cannot convince you, but I will say this so that lothers aren't sucked in.

John 8:31

“If you abide in My word, you are My disciples indeed."



Then, Jesus told His disciples:

Matthew 10:16

"I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves."



So, if you are a christian, then you are His Disciple. And if you are His disciple, then you must go out and share your faith in the world!



Nobody knows if their is a God or not.

Except for the fact that i just recieved an email on my brand new email account (which noone but me knew about) from someone who had died a year ago. They were praying to God for me. I was healed twice, the rain stopped when i asked it to once, my grandfather was healed, and my grandma heard God speak to her. I have come so close to speaking in tounges, and this entire last two weeks have been one huge 'coincidence' (as you would call it) where nothing but the BEST things could happen to me. It's only a 'coincidence' because I accepted Christ again a couple weeks ago.Oh, and when i worship Him, I can feel the presence of the Holy Ghost on me.



I KNOW there is a God, because he is a part of my life.



"And tying this in with the first paragraph, if nobody really knows if there is a God, then why evangelize about it?



The Eskimo asks, "If I never heard of Jesus, would I go to Hell?" Then Priest replies, "No." And the Eskimo asks, "The why did you tell me?"



Hmmm... maybe because of the JOY it brings to so many people?!? I have never been happier since I met Jesus. My worst day now is one-hundred times better than my best day when I was not a Christian. It gives hope to people, it keeps them from falling into temptations. And, let's just say that person stays 'unknowing' for fifty or so years. They are so in touch with themselves and mankind, that even if they do hear the name of Jesus, their hearts may be hardened enough where they still won't come to Him, and then they will go to hell.



All it takes is one mention of who jesus Christ is and a person should be able to figure out that he is the GOOD GUY!

Plus, there is that scripture that says that every nation will here of the Lord before His return (can't find scritpure, but if someone else could, please share!)



So, just be ready. When He returns, just remember, "I Told You So!"



Adam- great job, friend! You are learning well. You will do great things in life as a Christian!

tstiffler: I know you can't convince me... only I can convince me.



It could have been a hacker. My brother taught me how to hack into email accounts, it's fairly simple. Speaking in tounges? I can start blabbing in jiberish, claim it's Aramaic, and nobody would know the difference. How many times do I have to go through this feeling God thing. People feel different gods every single day... I've elaborated on this like 10 times this week.



If you can claim there is a God. And my Hindu student will claim Vishnu is real because it's a part of his life. You can not prove God is existant because you feel him. I'd say your under false consciousness.



"I told you so"? That sounds mean. I don't think that's what Jesus would do... you may want to pray for forgiveness for making premeditating an insult on someone... see the Buddha frowns on this kind of behavior



Christianity doesn't bring joy to everyone. If it did, then why is Islam growing faster then Christianity? (You don't really need to answer this, I know the answer. It was rhetorical)



Look, if Jesus make you happy, then follow him. But the beleif in him also causes death and suffering. It's a double-edged sword. Jesus gave me no peace.

Adam: That's fine, you don't have to agree with me. Maybe some people need youth groups to help them do charity work... personally I work better alone.

ggd- when I said'I told you so' I did not mean for it to sound mean. What I meant was this When jesus returns, you still have a chance to be saved. There is still the tribulation that you have to go through. Now, what i meant by 'I told you so' was, now you can believe what i said about Jesus and be saved. you said earlier that if God shopwed himself to you, than you would believe. Well, be ready, because He will be returning soon. And, even if you don't believe it, (pretend I am an atheist right now) IF Jesus returns soon, I would believe in Him immediately because so many people have told me that He is returning.



Ggd, there will be a lot of people that are going to still hate jesus after He returns, let me ask you something. If He does return, and millions of people are raptured, or the water turns to blood, or the sun gets hotter, or there are suddenly two mysterious preachers at the waling wall, are you going to believe? because thta is all in the Bible (revelation). I know that if we preach to you, that yopu are too blinded to see the truth, but wait and see what you will do when He returns for His church. Remember that you still have a chance to be saved. If you wait till the last minute, though, what's to say you won't live past tomorrow? (don't take that wrong, just saying what could be true. I don't know whe I will die either)



Oh, and if you fond God, you woul;d see that you could never ork alone again and be happy.